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windstuffnow

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Joined: 30/06/2006
Location: United States
Posts: 31

Posted: 07:54pm 08 Nov 2008

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Instead of big companies putting in there huge turbines and/or solar and paying for everything plus big buildings, huge CEO wages and all the luxuries we don't benifit from I propose a community based instalation program.

For instance, say each home is reasonably energy efficient and the electric usage is averaged at around 600kwh per month. Lets say it cost approximately 500,000 to install 1.5Mw of solar and wind. The comunity would consist of about 2500 homes sharing the 1.5Mw. Each home owner would need to pay an upfront cost of 300.00 for the purchase of panels and turbines as well as instalation. There would be a small monthly fee for continuous maintenance of say 20.00 each. Electric would be free for each home involved so 20 bux a month is simply pocket change in comparison to their used to be normal electric payment.

Now, the maintenance fee's provided would go directly to an escrow account which would accumulate approximately 600,000.00 anually. If maintenance was less expensive than the accumulated maintenance fee the system could be expanded by the excess to include other connected communities.

This would be a non-profit community power based organization so all the funds collected would go back into the system such as repairing turbines, replacing faulty panels and wages of the technitions doing the work.

This would be far better than the Pickens plan to build billions of dollars worth of wind turbines and charge everyone for thier use continuously forever. This way it is a one time up front cost and a very small maintenance fee to maintain the system.

This would be far cheaper than individual instalations costing 2-10,000 each.

This is simply an initial draft of some ideas I've been tossing around.... any thoughts or other expansive ideas?

GWatPE

Senior Member

Joined: 01/09/2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 2127

Posted: 11:29pm 08 Nov 2008

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Hi windstuffnow,

My house has approx 10kWhr consumption per day, or half what you estimate is OK. Maybe we should learn to use less electricity first.

Gordon.

become more energy aware

sodes

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Joined: 26/07/2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 21

Posted: 01:32am 09 Nov 2008

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Hi windstuffnow sounds like a pretty good idea to me, as I'm under the impression that the larger turbines are more efficient than the small ones anyway so it could be a goer. I think the biggest hurdle around my area would the getting the dang council to approve it all, I wouldnt mind having a huge turbine in my back paddock though!

Would create quite a few new jobs as well as some more work for local contractors, cant see anything wrong with that, cheers Sodes.Edited by sodes 2008-11-10

"Do, or do not... There is no try."
-Yoda

windstuffnow

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Joined: 30/06/2006
Location: United States
Posts: 31

Posted: 01:34am 09 Nov 2008

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It would definately require good energy management, just because its free or nearly free dosn't mean it should be wasted or abused.

We all know if something like this became popular it would be squashed by big companies and/or become a new "tax" for the government to collect on.

davef
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Joined: 14/05/2006
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 499

Posted: 03:26am 09 Nov 2008

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Think you have to look more carefully at the maths! Your current 600kWH per month is 20kWH per day. With 1.5MW installed plant that could supply 75 homes, consuming 20kWH per day each. If 1.5MW installed capacity did really only cost 500,000 dollars then each household would have to pay $6,666 not $300.

GWatPE

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Joined: 01/09/2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 2127

Posted: 05:23am 09 Nov 2008

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Hi windstuffnow,

the 1.5MW is the maximum generating capacity. This is an instantaneous figure. I have a 3.5kW total generating capacity system from wind and solar and the output equates to between 1 and 22kWhr per day. The average is approx 14kWhr/day over the whole year. I have 2.5kW of solar and 1kW of Wind.

My location is OK for wind and solar. The solar averages 12kWhr/day and the wind does 1.8kWhr/day. This is average with good and bad days included.

What you plan could have a similar distribution, but the wind could harvest double the proportions of my setup on a larger scale. The 1.5MW windmill on average could yield approx 5.4MWhr per day. This could be distributed to approx 270 homes on average. The figures are not as good as the 2500 you proposed. If these homes were to reduce consumption to 10kWhr/day, then 540 homes could be a target.

If the RE systems were as cost effective as you estimate, then we would not have coal or gas or nuclear, and possibly not even hydro.

I believe Chinese windmills come out at $1/W for windmills at the MW generating capacity. These these have to be installed with additional cost and then there is substations etc with the connection to the grid.

This example

The 1.5MW would be $1.5M. This would probably be double installed, so $3M. Say 270 homes. This would come out at $11000 per home. 20kWhr = approx $4/day or approx $1500 per year at todays prices. This would not be quite as good as money in the bank. Unfortunately more homes at lower consumption does not reduce the payback time for the individual. Government rebates and premium payments for exported RE power help. I do not know what the overall solution is.

Gordon.

become more energy aware

windstuffnow

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Joined: 30/06/2006
Location: United States
Posts: 31

Posted: 08:21pm 09 Nov 2008

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I was hoping someone would see the error. That tells me others have put a little thought into it...

Yes it comes out to a 1.5MW system assuming 10 hours of sun/wind per day would end up with approximately 450kwh per month. Comes closer to 750 homes using 600kwh or less.

The 6000.00 range is probably closer to accurate than my original post depending on the purchasing power of huge quantities of solar and wind. Even at that it's still only a one time expense as opposed to a high monthly bill forever and ever increasing. It was just a draft of an idea with many things still needed to be worked out.

Now on another note, how about a "carbon" tax. The governments of the world want to tax us on our carbon footprint. What a perfect excuse to create a reason to collect more money... how brilliant... next will be methane production from eating beans...

GWatPE

Senior Member

Joined: 01/09/2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 2127

Posted: 09:45pm 09 Nov 2008

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Hi windstuffnow.

The 10 hour average day is over-optimistic, unless all panels had a solar tracker.

Gordon.

become more energy aware

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