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Forum Index : Windmills : 500 watt chinese wind gen
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Bergen Newbie  Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi, has any one played with one of these chinese wind gens. I've purchased one off ebay to see what they like. It seems to spin very slow for the quoted 24 volt charging ( manual says 400 rpm) yet the blade pitch is very shallow. When I run the machine into a 48 volt load, it appears to be a lot better ( starting up, charging at lower speeds, spins more consistanly with the wind speed etc) Keep up the good work. This is a great forum 
Thanks Bergen Wind powers my house |
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martinjsto Senior Member  Joined: 09/10/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 149 |
hi bergen, welcome aboard it probably works better at 48v becouse it dosnt see the load until it reatches the load voltage. when connected to 24v batteries load it will load quickly and therefor stall the gen. my neighbour has a similar unit from china only worked for a short while then the controler stopped working. the mill seems fine but. the blades look ok, are they pvc? the neighbours are pvc and do work quite well the gens seem to be ok although i have read in this site someware the bearings can fail or slip easly probably worth replacing with fully sealed quality ones and locktight into place. i havnt stripped on apart but you could probably mod the unit with stronger magnets also keep away from trees and wind obstacles as much as possable \good luck martin good luck free power for all McAlinden WA |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi martinjsto, thanks for the reply The blades are fibreglass coated timber. I've resanded them, taking the rough casting edges off and repainted them. The bearings have already been replaced also as part of some the work done on the machine after reading elsewhere that they fail early. The gen only in the test position before it goes into its final higher location. Its easier at the moment get it up and down for adjustments, testing etc. as the final location is going to most likely be 60' in the air. (if the unit comes upto scratch) Currently using a Tristar TS60 shumt regulator and a 3 phase diode bridge after testing the orginal supplied regulator and found it to be very ordinary in performce and also seeing some of your members also discarding it. One of the tests that I done was to measure the OC DC voltage in about 5ms of wind and it measured at 120 volts. You probally right about the magnets. When I had the gen apart for the bearings, the magnets didn't appear to be any of these good neo's etc, they looked to me is if they are ceramic or similar ? IF anyone any info or thoughs on these units, please post a reply. Thanks Bergen Wind powers my house |
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| martinjsto Senior Member Joined: 09/10/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 149 |
load the unit with lights or shunt to 1/2 its o/c that will give you the internal resistance of the gen you can then calculate the actual power of the mill 500w isnt too bad, neo conversion will probably raise it to about 1kw, im no expert on these units or electronics but learned a lot from this site i had a post "testing the F&P" and recieved some good advice about testing gens. an ocillascope is realy good for this but i dont have on or for that matter know how to use one. i do know your looking for RMS which is root mean square of a ac output, 5ms wind producing 120v looks good but unless loaded dosnt mean much, the F&P produces over 650vac as a standard stator and hub streight out of the machine at about 450rpm but no or negligible amps thats why we convert to a usable voltage 48 or 24 or 12 with great amps for charging. i think your on the right track with the mods you have done already, my m8's unit has been running for over a year with no problems apart from the controler o sometimes only time will tell 
martin free power for all McAlinden WA |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi Martin, thanks for the reply. Thanks for the surgestion on the loading of wind generator to get the internal resistance. Ive grabed the electronic load unit from work and I'll try your surgestion over the weekend and see what the results are. The load unit will work on AC and DC, varible loading from 0 volts to 60 volts and up to 40 amps. Hopefully I'll get some meaningful info. Thanks Bergen  Wind powers my house |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi, Back with some results. This was taken with the wind speed around 4.5 ms (wind speed measured with a hand held aneometer and power measured using a electronic DC load) volts Amps Watts 25 0.1 2.5 30 0.5 6 35 0.5 17.5 40 0.8 32 45 2.0 90 50 2.5 125 55 2.5 137.5 60 2.2 132 65 1.2 78 70 0.6 42 75 0.15 11.25 80 0.1 8 interesting readings when the generator is meant to be a 24 volt unit. Regards Bergen  Wind powers my house |
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Tinker Guru  Joined: 07/11/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1904 |
Well, your "electronic DC load" does not mimic a 24V battery, does it now  .
BTW, the wattage in the second measurement should read 15. Tinker Klaus |
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GWatPE Senior Member Joined: 01/09/2006 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2127 |
Hi Bergen, I might suggest that a mill in the wind is a very difficult test apparatus. I assume that the electronic test load is basically a variable voltage clamp, like a variable battery. The load presents no load up to the set voltage. 
The plot indicates blade stalling at the 24V level. Are you sure the mill is not designed for 48V? The open cct voltage of 120V is a giveaway to suggest a design for around 48V. I am not fully familiar with this wind mill. I have seem packaging for other chinese mills and it would be easy to get the wrong voltage unit. There would be no point in replacing the rotor magnets unless you could utilize the higher voltage. The cut in voltage would effectively be even lower. It is difficult to rewire this type of generator. Do you have the option of changing the system voltage to 48V? cheers, Gordon. become more energy aware |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi all. Thanks for the comments. The generator was sold to me as a 24 volt unit, and it come with a 24 volt regulator, but when it was temp installed, it was haveing trouble charging a 24 volt battery. Then I changed regulator (after seeing some forum members having faulty units and looking inside the unit it looked very ordinary in design), it still had the same problem. The electronic load unit was set up as a battery eliminator (as per Gordons comments) except the unit was set at each of the voltage steps (ie 30 volts = a 30 volt battery) to find the gens best output at a given wind speed. 48 volt is no good to me at the moment, due to the way the rest of the system is set up. This morning I've pulled the unit down and seeing if I can get the windings out to see if a rewire is possible. Thankyou All James Wind powers my house |
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| bushrat Newbie Joined: 27/02/2008 Location: Posts: 3 |
Hi, i am interested in your experience. i wonder if the ebay item listing was labled "wind farm"? i have found a manufacturer in china that i think is the supplier of your mill. the price is very low fob china. the photos make it look a deal at $800 odd with tower, regulator and inverter. i was thinking of getting one direct from the factory for a test drive. so i will look for your further posts with interest! |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi Bushrat Just before I purchased this unit, I did contact the exporters in china of these wind generators. The price for the units and other ones was great, but the freight for one off's and small numbers was too expensive. The most economical method was via containers. This one come from pinnacle-wholesalers in Vic. Also from my last post, I've managed to get the windings out (after a little work to the houseing) and it can be wired for 24 or 48 volts. It looks as if it can also be wired for 12 volts with a little modification to the windings. Still investigating and testing at the moment. James Wind powers my house |
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| bushrat Newbie Joined: 27/02/2008 Location: Posts: 3 |
for the 500 watt model i was quoted USD 438 inc regulator, 6m tower, inverter. fob shanghai. i note the setup selling on ebay around aud 800. i am trying to decide whether to go with the chinese one, or one of the smaller remanufactured PMA units from the USA with good blades. i will be keen to know your results in due course! |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi Bushrat The chinese units need a little work doing to them before they are really usable, especially if you want it to last, be reliable and in my case as well as what I've read in this form, the regulator also needs to be replaced. As for the USA PMA units, I've seen them on the internet and thats about as much I know of them. They look like a better unit. Hopefully someone in this forum has a PMA or seen one and they might be able shed a little light on how good they are. I'll keep everyone informed on my progress with this unit Regards James Wind powers my house |
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| bushrat Newbie Joined: 27/02/2008 Location: Posts: 3 |
hi James hope i am not dragging this thread too far OT; here is a PMA typical of the remanufactured ones for wind: windblue power this guy uses some 3rd party aluminium blades from TLG Windpower who also make a heavy duty PMA. they both have packaged kits. seem like higher quality than the chinese and off the shelf replacement parts. |
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| martinjsto Senior Member Joined: 09/10/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 149 |
hi guys, these look like a mod as seen on this site. ac delco are a good unit, i have looked at doing a neo conversion on a unit but as you can buy a rotor it would be an easy conversion. the stator coils seem to be all the same, i believe the type of magnets change the charge cut in speed, i may be wrong there. the site does sell just the rotor so remove from one old alternator and fit in new one sounds like a good way to go, might have to try one thanks for the link martin free power for all McAlinden WA |
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| Bergen Newbie Joined: 19/02/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 19 |
Hi Bushrat, just had a look at the web site. They certainly look a better quality than the chinese unit, easy replacement parts and the price looks good too, especially how the Aust. dollar is now. The only worry is freight cost. There dosn't seem to be any cheap options for freight from US that I can see James Wind powers my house |
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