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Gizmo

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Joined: 05/06/2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 5116

Posted: 03:00am 04 May 2008

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Hiya guys.

Added a new page, this one is about Phill's ( filmm ) RE installation. Its on the articles page.
http://www.thebackshed.com/windmill/articles/list.asp
I would like to get more home grown RE stories for this page, I know its very inspiring for anyone new to RE to see how average people like us can make our own clean power. So if you want to add your own RE set up please let me know, all I need are a few photos and a bit of a write up, nothing fancy, I can clean it up for you.

Glenn

The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now.
JAQ

Bolty

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Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 10:09pm 10 May 2008

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Thanks Glenn for your posting Phill's installation. It is a great article that really interests me!
Whilst it has many facts and figures, one piece of information that I would be really keen on seeing added, is some idea of his energy produced. I note that he keeps a computer log of the data and it would be nice if there could be some kind of summary of that data!

Bolty

fillm

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Joined: 10/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 730

Posted: 08:18am 11 May 2008

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Hi Bolty ,
The logging that the laptop is monitoring is only for the windgen data ,via the piclog , the PL20 records the daily amp hours produced by the 4 x 80w panels which keep the second PVE 1200 connected to the grid while the sun is up . It turns on at approx 7.30am and stops at 5.00pm and the PL20 has been averaging 25 to 29 amp hrs a day at 53.4 Volts , 1.3 to 1.5 kw and the total on the grid meter on these days is usually 6 to 7 kw so the 1kw arrary is knocking out 4.5 to 5.5 kw a day , while my windgen has been very dismal of lately because of the total lack of wind , but that side is my hobby so if you want real power go solar if you don't have good wind , although I have been getting some good results with the dual stator , unmodified 80s stators in series with a 3.3m dia set of blades with the light winds . I hope that gives you a idea on what my system has been doing....

Phill

PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits

Bolty

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Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 03:46pm 14 May 2008

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Thanks for the info Phil!
I am particularly interested in your wind data, even though you have little wind at the moment. Do you have any values of peak power even if it is in a short transient wind! I am interested in this because I am looking at installing a grid-connect wind system to supplement my 1kw solar system. I am in the process of importing a 3 metre 1Kw 48 volt generator from China (it is currently on the ship and should be here in about 12 days) This was quite cheap and comes with a 48 volt controller. I intend to initially install the generator myself, probably using the controller with batteries. Then I will know whether my wind quantity is enough to consider the cost of a grid-connect inverter. I have been looking at the Latronics PV edge inverter and using their "currently being developed" grid tie batteryless controller. It will be available in about 6 weeks and does utilize PWM to control the output of the turbine. ( I have a separate posting on this forum on this!)

Clearly because the cost of the controller and grid connect inverter is over $2500, I need to be certain that it will produce sufficient power to warrant the expense and the trouble. I do not expect that it will be cost neutral over a period of years, but I do not want to end up producing insufficient power and costing say $1 per kwhour.

Hence I would welcome any wind data that you can provide! I realize that your situation is totally different to mine, but it would be intersting to know how much power you hope to produce over a year!

Thanks very much!

Bolty

imsmooth

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Joined: 07/02/2008
Location: United States
Posts: 214

Posted: 10:00pm 14 May 2008

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Can you give some specs on your tower? Height, diameter, distance of guy wires? How do you service the generator? Is there an easy way to take it down?

fillm

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Joined: 10/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 730

Posted: 11:51am 15 May 2008

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Hi Bolty ,

I do not know your location , but if you are considering spending that amount on a wind grid tie I hope you have done your home work on you average wind and the output graphs on the wind gen . I think I may have seen one of these new type chinese units when in Melb recently , it was set up on the roof of the renuable enegy store . Does yours have a centrifugal brake.. The unit I saw started in almost no wind and had good set of blades . My wind data at present is far from anything to talk about . Are you looking at putting the 1kw and the wind gen into a set of batts , when connecting wind to the PVE though batts you turn the Mppt off , you will loose some effiency on the 1kw system and you will have to be able to shut the solar/wind off when the grid is down to protect your batts . A 1kw system connected to a small batt bank would be explosive , is your 1kw system up and running ?
I take it you are considering a seperate inverter for the wind gen and then connecting the battery less controller to it in parallel with the 1kw system ?
My data ... last 5 days ( wind total .3kwh ) ( 4 x 80w panels 8 to 9 kw ) TOTAL OUTPUT 31 kw (inc 1kw sys ) so over the last 5 days to equal the solar panels with wind power I would need to build another 102 F&P dual stator gens or pray for the wind drought to end so I can carry on with experimenting with different stators etc ... Keep me informed of your progress ....

PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits

fillm

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Joined: 10/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 730

Posted: 11:37am 16 May 2008

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Hi Imsmooth

With regards to my tower specs , the tower is approx 7.5mt high in two sections . The lower section is 3 1/2" gal water pipe ,the upper section which pivots at the top of the lower is 3" shed 80 steam pipe . A hand winch mounted on the lower section lowers the upper on the piviot pin . I have noticed by all your test rig set you seem to be more inclined to woodwork , if you do not have good welding ability or facilities I strongly recomend you get a qualified person to do the welding / fabrication work .

I had a look at the link to your info page , with the rotor dia 8 to 10ft and what you are trying to achieve, from my experence so far with neos your test rpms are to high , this dia would be hard pressed to go through 300 rpms in 20 mph wind and the neos take a lot of power to drive , my advise is to get a configuration that gives the best output between 90 to 250 rpm at the voltage you require and do your testing at those speeds so at least it simulates the speed a mill would normally run at ... keep up the good work on neo's and keep us posted....

PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits

imsmooth

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Joined: 07/02/2008
Location: United States
Posts: 214

Posted: 04:09pm 16 May 2008

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Yes, I prefer woodwork when possible as it is easier for me to quickly throw something together. However, I have a 220v/230A arc-welder and I plan on using it when it comes to the tower fabrication. I should be able to build a small steel ship with this unit.

Is it possible for you to get some close-up pictures of your pole and pivot. I was actually thinking of doing something similar to your design: I want a large 15' base of about 3-3.5" with a pivoting upper section. I have not worked out the specifics, yet. How easy is it to put up and down? Does the upper pole need any guy-wire support when you raise or lower it?

The rotor that I have is aluminum and designed on a CAD system. The props spin unloaded close to 1200 RPM @ 40mph according to the source from which I purchased them. I will have to see what they really do. The roots are 10.5" to give a lot of torque.

My next step is to build a 10' testing pole and see what the prop does with the rotor.Edited by imsmooth 2008-05-18

Bolty

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Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 01:07pm 21 May 2008

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Hi Phill

Thanks for your reply. I am sorry that I have been unable to answer sooner!
My situation is that I have the 1kw system coming from China. It arrives by boat next week. (Freight costs by boat from China to Port Adelaide were $25. However the import handling costs run into $291. How can it be that it costs 11 times more to JUST get it off the ship in Australia compared to the total voyage from China.????@#$#$$@#?? ......This is not even including customs, which I should not have to pay, due to it being less than $1000........Sorry about my aside, but I have just been informed about the cost of all this and I am staggered about Australian handling costs!!!!!!)

I decided to import a 1kw unit and experiment with it before committing to the cost of grid connect. I have very little information on the generator at this stage, but will be able to give you more info when I get the turbine. It does include a 48 volt controller, but I am not expecting this to be any better than the others than I have seen on ebay.

My plans are to install the turbine, initially with a battery bank. I will then be able to ascertain the amount of power that it produces over an extended period. If this is worthwhile and I have sufficient wind here, I will consider buying a Latronics grid connect inverter with their yet to be released controller. If it does not prove worthwhile, I will continue to use an extended battery bank with a 48 volt NON grid inverter. I hope to be able to access some reasonable used batteries at virtually no cost.

By coincidence, Gordon (GWatPE)lives only about 5 kms from me! If the grid-connect inverter proves to be non-viable, he has suggested using the battery bank power for some non-critical power needs on my property. This will entail some re-wiring, but it will not be too difficult.

So in summary, I am still very much at the developmental stage. I have acquired a computer linked wind station and will be collecting wind data over the next few months to determine my wind regimes. As I have a 2.5 Ha property I have some flexibility where I can place my turbine. Some directions are sheltered by trees etc. so I want to try to optimize my wind input by choosing the most desirable position after an inspection of the data!

As I am holidaying in Queensland for 10 weeks from mid June, it is unlikely that I will get much done before I go. I certainly will not be erecting the turbine until after I return and can carefully analyze the collected wind data whilst I was away!

Many thanks for your information!

Regards

Bolty

Bolty

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Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 01:10pm 21 May 2008

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BTW. Phil it is pleasing to see that you are getting a bit of wind now!

Bolty

fillm

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Joined: 10/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 730

Posted: 09:06am 23 May 2008

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Hi Bolty ,

If you are comming up to Brisbane on your QLD holiday give me a call if you would like to drop in . Gordon has my phone No's ..

PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits

Bolty

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Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 02:51pm 23 May 2008

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Thanks for the offer Phill. We are travelling with friends, and at this stage we are not sure about our itinerary. I will certainly keep the option open, and will let you know!

madteckhead
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Joined: 04/07/2008
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Posts: 6

Posted: 11:14am 10 Jul 2008

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Hi Phill,
Great work on your setup, it is looking very slick. I am attempting to build something very similar, in term of the turbine design.

I'm actually not that mechanically minded (but that will not stop me!) but I like the design of your motor mount, the V design with the tail on one side and the motor on the other. Did you come up with the design yourself? Dose it have furling? (I want a desing without, and plan on having electronic breaking).

I was hoping you could provide some photo's up closer of the mounting frame, or even some design sketches to help me on my way.

I'm a student in Brisbane at the moment, so you will have to drop by when I get my turbine setup.

Thanks for sharing your set up with us,

Cheers,

Nathan

fillm

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Joined: 10/02/2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 730

Posted: 10:08am 13 Jul 2008

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Hi Nathan ,

I can suppily you with the basics of the dual stator bearing hub set up to my design and give you some direction on how to build something similar to my set up , firstly you will need 2 F&P Motors , 1 bearing hub that has been cut out of the tub with at least 1" of plastic arround the bearings and with the tools I have here will give you the start , if you are intrested email me phillmann@bigpond.com.au ... Phill...

PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits

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