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Forum Index : Electronics : 3Phase Inverter Needed
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| Cpoc Regular Member  Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
I have not posted here in a while. I am the one building the boat. Will finally start project in January 2026. I have already ordered my inverter boards from Wiseguy. They look amazing however my setup requires 3Phase power. My mig welder uses 3phase power and the diy chiller system that will provide me with cooling in the summer and heating in the winter also uses 3phase power. So I will ask the dev team of Wiseguy KeepIS and Poida if it is possible to have 3 X 6k inverters in 3phase mode. I believe its a software solution and not hardware then again I am unsure of this. Is it possible with new firmware to build a 3phase inverter. The new firmware would have and option for standalone or 3phase mode of L1 L2 L3. I do not know if this is possible. If not possible then I have no choice but to look at other solutions. I would rather have a diy solution this way if the system stops working I can fix it instead of replacing the whole unit. Any feedback from the dev team is welcomed. Thank You |
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| Godoh Guru  Joined: 26/09/2020 Location: AustraliaPosts: 591 |
Have a look at this thread, there is a lot of information in it about 3 phase inverter tinkering 3 phase inverter for AC motors |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
Thanks Godoh for the link. It seems that it would require a hardware change and not just a firmware update. The other 2 solutions are to either purchase 3 victrons and jump ship to to all victron gear works well but very expensive solution or the purchase 3 Luxpowertek all in one inverters.They are alot less expensive but Chinese cloud based and we all know what happened to Deye inverters. Last option use the 12kw inverter in single phase and purchase a phase converter. this is a heavy and expensive option as well. I am still waiting feedback from dev team. |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
I have been doing more research on 3phase inverters and how they are setup. I believe no hardware change is required on the current Wiseguy design hardware and only a software change is needed along with a new hardware master controler board. The software change on the current design would be needed to enable a serial port in the nano controller board more info on this link The firmware would need an option of Standalone,3Phase L1,3Phase L2,3Phase L3 along with are the necessary code to talk with the master controller. The 3 inverters would be independent and be connected to the master controller via serial rs485 or rs232. The master controller would be in charge of keeping the 3 inverters in sync this way all 3 inverters can work out of balance and the 3 inverters can be in the same enclosure of separate enclosures. Would like the feedback on the dev team of this idea would work |
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wiseguy Guru Joined: 21/06/2018 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1227 |
Hi Carlos, I am currently on a caravan holiday and wont be home until the beginning of December, we are currently over 2000km from home. I consider myself to be essentially a hardware guy, I have always had access to software writers either as colleagues, employees or contractors. Whilst it was an efficient way to design & get products to market quickly, usually bug free, now that I no longer have access to good software writers (Poida excepted of course) I can't be of much help to you in your 3 phase inverter requirement. In my first 10 years as an engineer I was instructed to utilise the in house software writers and concentrate on my analog & PCB designs. When I started my own company after them, I was too busy to try to learn & write software and there were also very real commercial risks involved. Once, I did design a 3 phase power analyser with ethernet & remote display features, which of course was software intense. But creating a mains 3-phase inverter from scratch, I would probably go down the 48 - 400VDC path and then pwm the HVDC with 3 half bridge power circuits that use IGBTs for the spwm power switching & employing inductors and capacitive outputs, ie no output transformer. The only isolation would be in the 48V to 350V converter. With regard to synchronisation I would be more inclined to explore 3 phase generation from the one micro might be a better approach? I would be interested in what others think too. Edited 2025-11-11 19:17 by wiseguy If at first you dont succeed, I suggest you avoid sky diving.... Cheers Mike |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
Thanks for the reply Wiseguy however I need a fully unbalanced system. The current 3phase inverters that are single units are all balanced which means that you cannot be to far apart in your loads good for 3 phase devices not so good for single phase device loads. Luxpower supports balanced loads in single inverters. Unbalanced loads are 3 X inverters conbected in 3phase via CAN. Luxpower has publicly stated that when you buy their inverters the end user owns the hardware but the software belongs to Luxpower which means that if your inverter is connected to the cloud then they can remote brick it for whatever reason. I do not like cloud based devices for this and other reasons. |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
Another solution would be to have 1 unit Luxpower 3phase low voltage for all the 3 phase loads and the second unit 12kw Wiseguy design for all single phase loads. Still hoping for a DIY 3phase solution. |
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| analog8484 Senior Member  Joined: 11/11/2021 Location: United StatesPosts: 173 |
It would be great if a DIY multi-inverter 3 phase solution can be realized. However, if commercial solution is considered then perhaps Victron would be better than Luxpower in terms of openness and safety (LF output transformer based) given the target environment is a boat in Europe. The downside is likely higher cost. BTW, I know 3 phase inverter solutions are more complicated in the US due to various configurations (e.g. Wye, Delta, High-Leg Delta) with different associated voltages and I wonder if it's simpler in Europe and Australia. Edited 2025-11-12 05:17 by analog8484 |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
Problem with Victron is price. Its at least 4 times the price of a Luxpower system and you need to purchase many extras like mppt controllers cables and display. Luxpower is all in one and comes with 2 mppt controllers per unit with display. If worried about the high voltage per string then use Tigo optimizer that you can monitor each solar panel and gives shade protection as well. It really comes down to price. So far everything I have researched says its a very solid product. The 12K off grid version comes with conformal coating on all its pcb parts. I will wait till the other dev team members give their feedback. No hurry to build system now. |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
In Europe they use the star configuration. L1 L2 L3 and shared neutral. Voltage is either 400V or 415V 50HZ line to line. Single phase voltage is either 230v or 240v here is Portugal its 240V and 415V for 3Phase. Europe is 50HZ same as Australia. |
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| nickskethisniks Guru Joined: 17/10/2017 Location: BelgiumPosts: 467 |
Since you allready have all the parts I would start building a single phase inverter and go from there. Later on you can evaluate your inverter and if satisfied and are still motivated you can wind 2 other transformers and just remove the single phase controller and add 1 controller board with something like an atmega2560 or even the black/bluepill boards as beating heart. Yes this board needs to be designed yet. I would not start with 3 different controllerboards and make them synchronise, just safer to use 1 board, but keep a spare at hand. The link godoh sent with poida 3ph code I've allready tested and works but I put that project on hold because of other projects. Like Mike suggested is a good route and works with assymetric loads as well. With a collegue of mine we have build a prototype 3.6KVDC nominal to 3ph 400VAC converter last year to charge electric cars from the high voltage line of the train network and the last stage was a +-350VDC bus wich provided a neutral point so we also had single phase 230V with just 3 halfbridge converters. It was no problem to charge for example 2 cars on 11kW each on 3 phase and 1 car at 7kW single phase at the same time. The output voltage was regulated by keeping the bus voltage stabilized. So there was a little bit of voltage sag, around 5V, could be compensated based on the load current. The controller we used was this evaluation board CY8CKIT-059, really nice stuff. Edited 2025-11-12 06:07 by nickskethisniks |
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| analog8484 Senior Member Joined: 11/11/2021 Location: United StatesPosts: 173 |
Have you checked Victron EasySolar? It's their all-in-one offering. Solution cost is still likely higher. |
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| analog8484 Senior Member Joined: 11/11/2021 Location: United StatesPosts: 173 |
Can you expand on what you mean by "works" in terms of load types? I seem to remember that poida was having problems powering motor loads? |
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| nickskethisniks Guru Joined: 17/10/2017 Location: BelgiumPosts: 467 |
It would be a little bit "over dimensioned" using 3 separate mosfet full bridges, but it would make a very powerfull inverter for sure. I would be tempted to build something like this myself. I'm close to start with my inverter with Mike his hardware boards, I've actually build myself a protoype +-450VDC powersupply with his mosfetboard, so the powerboard is actually allready tested :p. Add you 6 igbt's and you have yourself a 3ph inverter.  But I really need a spare single phase inverter first, and before I start that I need to finish my batterybank first.  |
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| nickskethisniks Guru Joined: 17/10/2017 Location: BelgiumPosts: 467 |
I can't remember his testing setup, I think he used a higher voltage bus voltage and used igbt's? I did not much testing but I tested both, at lower power my testing setup used low voltage (48Vnom) and step up transformers and wired in star. At higher voltage I used IGBT's (but only single phase) and ramped up the voltage on 1 half bridge with neutral point, to about +-350V with a 2000W load (electric heater). I did try 3 ph but not on high power. I did not try motors. When I have more time I could dust off my testing rig and do testing. I did notice you need quite some bus capacitance when using single phase if you but capacitors in series. |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
The most cost effective setup would be 3 X Luxpower 6k single phase connected in 3phase each unit here in Europe can be had for 600 Euros. 1 X 6K Wiseguy design inverter which would be connected only to L1 for critical loads on a change over switch. This way if all goes bad I can manually power up the 6K single phase and use the Wiseguy inverter for all my critical loads. I can also rewire the AC breaker box and connect 2 X Luxpower in parallel single phase mode as well. In the US the Luxpower units are twice the cost you can thank the tariffs for that one. The 12K units are double the price but you get more value and 2 mppt controllers. The 12K units would be overkill but very impressive for the price. Victron has nice gear but way too expensive. |
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Revlac Guru Joined: 31/12/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1207 |
Those cheap Lux units look like the voltronic re-brands (is that correct?) I started with about 10 years ago, the oldest one is still working as are the 2 later 5kw units at the house, I never bought the parallel cards and accessories to do 3phase with them. I have seen inside them and they may work (3Phase) for the price, But DIY build is still preferred.  Edited 2025-11-12 10:12 by Revlac Cheers Aaron Off The Grid |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
The Luxpower are NOT voltroinix those are garbage, bad design and even worse firmware. Luxpower does not build the inverters as they are a R&D company. Their design is solid and their firmware is also very solid. Only issue I have found is the 6K units do not have conformal coating but the 12K units do have conformal coating. I would rather a DIY design with Wiseguy hardware open hardware where I can fix it myself. The software can be closed and released as a hex file like the current design. I do not need an AC charger or integrated mppt controllers just a solid 3phase design for unbalanced loads so I can run both 3phase and single phase loads. Luxpower has been field tested for many years and they even make weatherproof expensive units as well and are fully grid tied compliant and certified. Problem with these units are very complex in design and nearly impossible to repair if they are not in warranty. They have a 5 tear warranty like Victron. |
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| Revlac Guru Joined: 31/12/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1207 |
Any commercial inverter weather it be Rubbish or Good quality will not be a straight forward repair likely more damage in a blowup than is visible, also makes commercial Inverter useless when it fails can be a long time and effort to sent it away to get it fixed......I know, so having a spare inverter and parts was the best way to keep going. Yes have to agree, its the better way and fault finding in case of repair should be relatively easy. Edited 2025-11-12 12:31 by Revlac Cheers Aaron Off The Grid |
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| Cpoc Regular Member Joined: 28/05/2024 Location: PortugalPosts: 97 |
I was wrong in the warranty period the 5 year warranty cover only the hybrid series. The 6k and 12k have only a 2 year warranty. Look here Edited 2025-11-12 12:46 by Cpoc |
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